Gaming thoughts, bite-size chewables - new orange flavor!

[malor]

Connecting old consoles directly to a modern display should be the last resort, it'll never look nice.

That's particularly true of the PS1, because it did such weird stuff with its output. Devs were constantly changing output resolution, which will often cause a loss of sync with flat panels.

One of the Final Fantasy games, for instance, I think it was 8 maybe, changed resolution between the main playfield and the management screens, using a higher resolution mode, probably to make the text look better. On a CRT, the change is instant and invisible, where the opposite is frequently true with current monitors and TVs.

at the cost of a bit of added latency.

That's where the Mister really shines; drive a CRT directly with one, and the latency is about the same as the original console. In many cases, the output is bitperfect. Different cores were written by different people, and they usually don't have all the niceties of software emulation, but many are quite featureful. The SNES core, for instance, doesn't offer save states, but the GBA core does. I think the PS1 core does, too.

The computer cores mostly work, but many lack polish. If you're interested in emulating specific machines, be sure to check on the quality of the cores you want before buying. Some are outstanding (Amiga, Atari ST, TI 99/4A), some are decent but buggy, like the AO486 core, and a few are just broken, like the Mac 68K emulation.

Console cores, on the other hand, are usually close to perfect.

 

[mitty84]

Recently, I fired up a GDQ speedrun video of some random game, just looking for something to watch. I watched it for a bit, then realized the game looked pretty dang good. I stopped the video for any more spoilers and purchased said game.

The game is Astalon: Tears of the Earth, and I don't know how this flew over my radar. It is a metroidvania with a rouge-like 'get better by purchasing upgrades after you die' mechanic. Fixed map though, no proc gen.

It's just a solid game. You start with three characters: knight, archer, and mage that you need to switch between to progress through this tower. The music is really good, the 8-bit art is good, just all around enjoyable. The map is also quite large. I've yet to pull the trigger on the last boss, but it has been enough to completely pull me from both Mario Wonder and Mario RPG. It's also available for pretty much every platform. (I played on XBox)

If metroidvanias are your cup of tea, you won't be disappointed.

 

[Elore]

One of the Final Fantasy games, for instance, I think it was 8 maybe, changed resolution between the main playfield and the management screens, using a higher resolution mode, probably to make the text look better. On a CRT, the change is instant and invisible, where the opposite is frequently true with current monitors and TVs.

Yeah, switching between 240p and 480i was not uncommon for menus or art galleries and such.

That's where the Mister really shines; drive a CRT directly with one, and the latency is about the same as the original console. In many cases, the output is bitperfect. Different cores were written by different people, and they usually don't have all the niceties of software emulation, but many are quite featureful. The SNES core, for instance, doesn't offer save states, but the GBA core does. I think the PS1 core does, too.

The Mister/FPGA emulation in general is definitely something I've been keeping an eye on, but I can't quite see myself using one in its current state, at least not for something like the PS1. The image quality enhancements that are possible for PS1 games are just too tempting.
With the PS2 gen I don't mind sticking to original visuals with real hardware on a CRT since the jump in processing power was so substantial for that generation (and the PS2 in particular has fantastic homebrew support that adds a lot of useful QoL features), but they're beyond the capabilities of Mister anyway.
But PS1, Saturn and N64 are all pretty rough in their own way, and emulation helps to make the games feel more like I remember them to look like, versus what they actually look like.

Might not be a bad idea to get one set up for the SNES, though ...

 

[CPX]

Connecting old consoles directly to a modern display should be the last resort, it'll never look nice.

Well most old consoles don't really do HDMI on their own, so...

 

[malor]

Might not be a bad idea to get one set up for the SNES, though ...

The SNES core is excellent, AFAIK supporting all the ancillary chips and memory mapping modes, but doesn't have save states. I tend to prefer higan on Windows for that reason, although I'd play super-latency-sensitive games like Punch-Out on the Mister.

RIP to byuu, btw. Their loss was such a tragedy.

 

[Elore]

Well most old consoles don't really do HDMI on their own, so...

That's true, of course, but there are a number of ways you might end up in that situation. Some TVs/receivers do still have analog inputs, someone might be tempted to make use of one of those either directly or through a converter. There are numerous cables available that contain an analog-to-digital converter inside them of varying quality. And then there's hardware mods like the PS1Digital that will let it output HDMI, although granted, if you're doing that you probably know what you're doing and why you're doing it anyway.

The SNES core is excellent, AFAIK supporting all the ancillary chips and memory mapping modes, but doesn't have save states. I tend to prefer higan on Windows for that reason, although I'd play super-latency-sensitive games like Punch-Out on the Mister.

Hm yeah, save states would definitely be useful. One mitigating factor on the modern emulation side that I forgot to mention is the black magic that is run-ahead. For cores supporting it that can shave off a good bit of latency if you've got it running on a reasonably powerful machine.

RIP to byuu, btw. Their loss was such a tragedy.

Yeah. Just ... bah.

 

[Ardax]

RIP to byuu, btw. Their loss was such a tragedy.

Wait, what? That's really unfortunate.

 

[malor]

Wait, what? That's really unfortunate.

Yeah, they were driven to suicide by Gamergaters because they were trans.

 

[CPX]

That's true, of course, but there are a number of ways you might end up in that situation. Some TVs/receivers do still have analog inputs, someone might be tempted to make use of one of those either directly or through a converter. There are numerous cables available that contain an analog-to-digital converter inside them of varying quality. And then there's hardware mods like the PS1Digital that will let it output HDMI, although granted, if you're doing that you probably know what you're doing and why you're doing it anyway.

Eh, the little HMDI<>S-Vid/Composite adapter box I have for my SNES is absolutely fine. The only adjustment I need to make for my screen is forcing 4:3 when playing.

 

[Jonathon]

Some kind of component connection (YPbPr or SCART if available, or even S-Video) is going to help a lot; composite video is awful and was awful even back then on a CRT TV.

But even that's only going to get you so far on a console as old as the PS1, when the best the console can do is 480i and many games on the console run at somewhere around half that resolution. There's not really anything you can do to make that much upscaling look good on a modern TV.

 

[CPX]

Some kind of component connection (YPbPr or SCART if available, or even S-Video) is going to help a lot; composite video is awful and was awful even back then on a CRT TV.

But even that's only going to get you so far on a console as old as the PS1, when the best the console can do is 480i and many games on the console run at somewhere around half that resolution. There's not really anything you can do to make that much upscaling look good on a modern TV.

Funny story, you can find YPbPr cables that work for the SNES, N64, and GameCube interchangeably. Nintendo strangely changed that interface for the Wii.

 

[Jonathon]

Funny story, you can find YPbPr cables that work for the SNES, N64, and GameCube interchangeably. Nintendo strangely changed that interface for the Wii.

In US models, there's RGB component video on the AV multi out port on the SNES but not on the N64 (which needs a hardware mod to get it, in all regions) or GameCube (which only does component video via its digital AV out port, and that cable was/is expensive). The best you can get consistently across all models via the analog port is S-Video.

The Wii has YPbPr component on its analog AV out, which, TBH, makes it a better GameCube than the GameCube (component cables for it were way cheaper than the GameCube ones, if your GC even supported them).

 

[richleader]

^ Yeah, I couldn't even afford the cables when the GC was NEW. (I think you had to order them direct?) Two new games vs. progressive scan was always a hard call back in the day.

 

[Diabolical]

In between finishing Alan Wake 2 (see thread!) and kicking off a month and a half of PC Game Pass for $1 + $9.99? I played some demos!
Woo!

The good!
URBO - City builder from the Diplomacy Is Not An Option folks. Sort of. Think Islanders mixed with a connect-4 title. Place buildings according to the little cards you get. 3 buildings of the same type merge into a bigger building. The object is to get the highest score for a given area and building selections. The demo is called URBO: Dream One, and is the first level of the game. I spent 54 minutes on this. That's how much it sucked me in. Pretty cool.

--+--

Erra: Exordium - 2d action/adventure platformer. I shouldn't like this. The movement is a bit slow and limited. There is a parry. But there is something about the adventure game elements and the story telling and the atmosphere that just gets to me. Interesting. It is also VERY brown.

--+--

American Arcadia - Side scrolling adventure game in the vein of Inside and JJ Macfield and Limbo, etc. Except it's somehow The Truman Show. And it has full on point and click adventure elements that I thought I would hate and I don't? I liked what little of the demo I played so much that I bought it.

--+--

Immortals of Aveum - You know that game out that was built in Unreal 5 that was Three-Color-Magic FPS? Well, the demo does a decent job of selling the movement and the general story and the basics of the shooting. I have added it to the wishlists. The demo was released very recently. No screenshot for this one - you've probably seen it.

--+--

The Okay!
Windswept - Pixel art collectathon platformer. You play as a duck. Or a turtle. Or other things. Switch characters (and abilities) on the fly. I'm not going out of my way for it, but it looked and felt nice enough.
Retro Commander - Imagine old school Command and Conquer, but it has the art style of Advance Wars. This is that game. Has a weird monetization thing where the base multiplayer game and the first chapter of the campaign are free. Want more stuff (modes, mods, maps, the rest of the campaign)? It'll cost you $20.

The Meh! You want links? I'm not going to link these. Your copy-paste-fu is strong enough.
Obsidian Legion - 2d action platformer that's want to be a souls like. I dislike the use of the stamina gauge, and it's not stand-out enough in this stupidly packed genre for me to care.
Infinity Girl - Runner. One of the authors on RPS recommended it in an article. I tried it. I disagree. It's crap.
Howl - Imagine Into the Breach, but hand drawn, and with a fantasy setting. Gorgeously stylized, and not my kind of game at all. I was instantly bored.


Anyway, Onto Cocoon!

 

[headache]

Against the Storm is leaving early access December 8th. It's a rougelite-ish, RTS-ish city builder set in a post apocalyptic fantasy world. The buildings you can choose are randomized each run, so you have to problem solve each run, and not just roll through your optimized build order.

I picked it up this summer after reading some chat about it here, and have put more than 100 hours into it since - it's become a lazy weekend morning with coffee standby.

It's also coming to game pass, I believe.

View: https://youtu.be/FsuCV86Pf5Y

 

[yd]

I played through what I thought was the final level of Shadow Tactics; Aiko's Choice. Took me 8 hours and 41 minutes. Brutal'ish for sure. I absolutely abused Yuki's flute and trap combo. To be honest, I am not sure how I would have finished the level without her. I'd love to know how someone could ever get the badge for a speed run of under 30 minutes, absolutely crazy. That said, I mop up every person I can get and aim for no detections unless kinda required as part of the level.

Then I find that isn't even the final level! What an epic game!

edit - I will check out that American Arcadia post Shadow Tactics @Diabolical ; I need things that don't get me near as wound up late evenings like PUBG. Its why I really like getting Chicken Dinner, better yet early, best yet first match of the evening so then I quit.

 

[Doomlord_uk]

If you want a real PS1, you'll probably want to scare up some kind of CRT to go with it.

This is absolutely in my future, but there is zero room in our current house for that. I don't really want to be reminded just how giant those monstrosities were actually

 

[swiftdraw]

I had a nice CRT TV with built in DVD and VHS player, but the screen was irreparably damaged during my last move -_- It was fantastic for the SNES and PS2 games I still go back and play on occasion.

 

[Defenestrar]

The Steam categories are dumb.
View attachment 68227

Since when are non-randomized, fully scripted games like Elden Ring and Lies of P considered Rogue-like? I could see them classified as RPGs (due to the stat growth), but Rogue-Like?

There's not many of us left who have actually played Rogue.

But in my mind the category requires these two items:

• Procedurally generated levels
• Permanent death

I'm disgruntled with the application of the phrase Rogue-like if it also doesn't have:

• Top-down view
• Mystery equipment (e.g. must identify each run-through)
• A quest for a McGuffin
• Multiple z-levels

Whether these secondary items are required elements for designation as a Rogue-like might be up for debate, but the first category is an absolute must in my opinion.

I get that Rogue hasn't exactly been easily and continuously available, but Nethack has been for decades. Someone should at least be adept in Nethack before attempting to use the phrase Rogue-like to describe another game.

 

[malor]

I think that ship has sailed, @Defenestrar. The word has been hijacked and redefined by younger gamers, and there is frak-all we can do about it.

It started with Rogue Legacy, which called itself a roguelite. Many of us not-quite-as-greybeards-at-the-time scoffed at the monicker, but the game was really good, and that got the term to stick.

Everything after that was pretty much inevitable, and our opinions about it don't matter in the slightest. I think the only thing left is procedural levels.

 

[Apteris]

This retro kick we seem to find ourselves on is something I agree with.

---

I'm finding Fallout 1 kinda hard. I chose to fight Decker along with his nigh-immortal bodyguard Kane and assorted other goons, and set an additional goal for myself of not letting any of my allies die. That fight was ridiculous. It required the full power of friendship (me, Ian, Tycho, and Dogmeat, along with Sheriff Greene and his two deputies), some Buffout and Psycho, and around 30 reloads before I got a win.

Now I'm running from deathclaws and letting my companions shoot at / bite them, but they take so_much_ammo to kill.

I should probably mention that I'm playing as the willowy young woman whose tag skills are sneak, steal, and unarmed combat, I'm at level 5, and currently coming down off the aforementioned all-natural performance enhancers.

Am I playing this right?

 

[Defenestrar]

I'm finding Fallout 1 kinda hard.

Am I playing this right?

If you are having fun, you are playing it right.

 

[Ecmaster76]

I should probably mention that I'm playing as the willowy young woman whose tag skills are sneak, steal, and unarmed combat, I'm at level 5, and currently coming down off the aforementioned all-natural performance enhancers.

Am I playing this right?

I think I picked the same character for my playthrough

By the end I was using power fists to pop super mutants like piñatas!
It was glorious

 

[CPX]

If you are having fun, you are playing it right.

Aye, one of the hard lessons to unlearn from modern gaming is stepping away from min/max philosophy, though I do understand the appeal with limited time to try and experience as much possible content in one go.

 

[LordDaMan]

Finish Rage 2 and come back to us. I’ll be genuinely curious to see what you think.

I remember being optimistic when I started it. That… well, it didn’t last.

I finished it today. I liked the game. Maybe not the most original, but it was good. The game engine can really make some beautiful landscapes.

I did get like all the vehicles at first. then after using them, they pretty much all suck except for the beginning one and the little hover bike.

\

 

[LuNatic_]

Dragon's Dogma 2 is looking fantastic in every regard except for the price-tag. Ouch. Still want it though.

 

[Nekojin]

Euro Truck Simulator 2 had an update today. If you read the patch notes, it seems a relatively minor update - the biggest detail in the patch notes is that they've added used trucks to the game, as a cheaper alternative to buying brand new trucks.

This is actually a massive overhaul to the game. Previously, parts of the truck take damage, and you repair them separately or collectively whenever you feel the need. Some sorts of malfunction happened once you passed a certain percentage of damage, like the engine stalling due to engine damage. Now, however, things are different. Parts not only take repairable damage, they also take permanent damage that can only be fixed with replacement or a total renovation. Wheels, in particular, can no longer be repaired, just replaced (or, if they do get repairable damage, their permanent damage is much higher proportionally than for any other part).

This is important, so that used trucks can be something you need to have fixed up before it's drivable or they can be marginally drivable, and take your chances on buying and using them for profit before they break down. I can imagine that some players will try to flip trucks, buying worn-but-usable trucks and running them into the ground, then replacing them.

 

[Diabolical]

There is a hero making videos of Pokemon based on National Geographic. Complete with a satirical character 'Mike' who has a three-barrell name and a psuedo David Attenborough persona.

And I want more of it. I wish this was a full fledged show.


--+--

I am sitting with 3 of 4 Orb World Ball Things in Cocoon. Just busy with other things. Maybe some playtime on Friday or Saturday.

 

[LordDaMan]

There is a hero making videos of Pokemon based on National Geographic. Complete with a satirical character 'Mike' who has a three-barrell name and a psuedo David Attenborough persona.

And I want more of it. I wish this was a full fledged show.

I loaded up that link and youtube started showing some self-defense non-lethal gun ad. All I could think is Ash just flat out shooting pokemon for shits and giggles nowadays?

edit:

 

[greatlakeexpat]

Seeing some of the posts about connecting old consoles makes me think of some of the upscale solutions (and if money isn't a concern).

Example: https://www.retrotink.com/product-page/retrotink-4k

It's $750.

Before I went more down the emulator hole (partly because real games got pricy during COVID), I got has far as some SCART->HDMI adapters.

If I actually had the investment in old games though, $750 to do all the things wouldn't be horrible.

 

[Quarthinos]

Had the flu the last two days and it gave me some time to play more Horizon: Zero Dawn. I don't think I have anything to add to the glowing praise it deservedly attained.

 

[malor]

Seeing some of the posts about connecting old consoles makes me think of some of the upscale solutions (and if money isn't a concern).

Example: https://www.retrotink.com/product-page/retrotink-4k

It's $750.

Before I went more down the emulator hole (partly because real games got pricy during COVID), I got has far as some SCART->HDMI adapters.

If I actually had the investment in old games though, $750 to do all the things wouldn't be horrible.

If you're willing to suffer with mere 1080p output, the Mister has many of those features built in to its scaler, and can emulate almost all the consoles. (no HDR support, though, at least for now, and the absolute max resolution it can handle is 1920x1440, which is really good for old 4:3 content, but not all monitors like it. And its max refresh is about 80Hz.)

If you don't already have lots of real hardware, that strikes me as offering more value per dollar.

But, wow, if you're a collector, that version of the Retrotink looks amazing.

 

[Thorvard]

I've been having a good time with Wizordum

Fun game, and runs pretty well on the Deck.

 

[technophile]

Had the flu the last two days and it gave me some time to play more Horizon: Zero Dawn. I don't think I have anything to add to the glowing praise it deservedly attained.

I'm so excited for Forbidden West to come out on PC next year!

 

[malor]

I'm so excited for Forbidden West to come out on PC next year!

People seem less enthusiastic about the sequel, overall, but the first one was so good that I'll be in shortly after release, after making sure that it runs. HZD was not in good shape when it first shipped. It's fine now, though.

 

[Artichoke Sap]

People seem less enthusiastic about the sequel, overall, but the first one was so good that I'll be in shortly after release, after making sure that it runs. HZD was not in good shape when it first shipped. It's fine now, though.

It's not as good a game, holistically; the story and characters are weaker, especially. Mechanically, however, it's more fun to actually play. The weapon, skill, and enemy balance is much more even, and has some welcome variety. (though, human opponents hit too hard and take too much damage, in a ludo-narrative dissonance; it's fine once you accept it).

People who just like Lure Call and Silent Strike might be disappointed, and the Blast Sling is no longer brokenly overpowered, so you have to learn some new tricks. But the variety of weapons and skills lets you keep it fresh, swapping out your approach to combat completely, while still being effective, and having a good time.

 

[cogwheel]

It started with Rogue Legacy, which called itself a roguelite. Many of us not-quite-as-greybeards-at-the-time scoffed at the monicker, but the game was really good, and that got the term to stick.

At least Rogue Legacy met the basic requirements of procgen and permadeath.

Calling Elden Ring a Rogue-like isn't objectively incorrect because "Rogue-like" has some holy inviolate meaning passed down from the old neckbeards, it's objectively incorrect because it causes "Rogue-like" to lose 99% of its meaning.

If you're willing to suffer with mere 1080p output, the Mister has many of those features built in to its scaler, and can emulate almost all the consoles. (no HDR support, though, at least for now, and the absolute max resolution it can handle is 1920x1440, which is really good for old 4:3 content, but not all monitors like it. And its max refresh is about 80Hz.)

It's also still several hundred dollars. Definitely more for less when compared to the RetroTINK 4K, but still not at all cheap.

If you don't already have lots of real hardware, that strikes me as offering more value per dollar.

But, wow, if you're a collector, that version of the Retrotink looks amazing.

If you do have real hardware, the OSSC is quite a bit cheaper (~$150 if your consoles all can output component) and only really loses the CRT emulation and 4K upscaling.

 

[CPX]

It's not as good a game, holistically; the story and characters are weaker, especially.

Aloy, especially in HFW, is a character study in almost entirely wrecking a character.

 

[technophile]

Aloy, especially in HFW, is a character study in almost entirely wrecking a character.

Oh, that's disappointing; I loved the story and worldbuilding of the first one, so I guess I'll have to manage expectations for the second go round.

 

[CPX]

Oh, that's disappointing; I loved the story and worldbuilding of the first one, so I guess I'll have to manage expectations for the second go round.

I should be fair, it's not that Aloy becomes a trash character or anything but rather that FW fully embraces the problem started in Z completely dropping any of Aloy's personal growth to turn her into a pure plot vessel. Go in expecting a great gameplay experience but don't expect any real compelling narrative for Aloy. Damn shame, too.